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why jazz players hate rockers?

vy
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vy
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02/16/2002 7:34 pm
i noticed a common hatred for rockers amongst jazz players for rockers why is it
will someone explain me why cause i play both and i cant support any one group as i love both styles

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# 1


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02/16/2002 8:19 pm

Maybe because Rock is so present on radio and much more accessible to people than Jazz.

Envy maybe???? but looking at what is played on radio, I must admit that there are some really $%&?ty stuff out there. Some rock songs are really bad but still sell.

Go figure

Not being from the jazz scene my opinion may not be relevant.
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# 2
lalimacefolle
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lalimacefolle
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02/16/2002 10:56 pm
Because they wish they had amplifiers that went to 11 too...
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# 3
Bardsley
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Bardsley
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02/17/2002 2:25 am
I also play both kinds (Country AND Western... just kidding) and I think they can go nicely hand in hand. If you look at where Miles waw going at the end of his career, and the mutual respect that he and Hendrix shared, there are certainly jazz players who have similar opinions. However, I could see why jazz players would see rock as simply being a less sophisticated form of music - that has similar roots to jazz in blues - that steals all the crowds. Jazz players could be justified in getting annoyed at the way musicianship isn't as important in rock, yet it is rock musicians who get called things like "the greatest guitarist ever" etc.
"Dozens of people spontaneously combust each year, it's just not that widely reported".
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# 4
chris mood
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chris mood
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02/18/2002 5:56 am
I was what you would call a jazz snob during my college yrs., and the main complaint I hear from jazz players about rock musicians is that their "lazy". Most never explore the possibilities of the instrument. An whats w/that Drop D thing and power chords? It's cool if you can actually play and your looking for that effect, but a lot of players use it as a crutch. You can't get away with that in jazz, classical, or blues.
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# 5
Christoph
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02/19/2002 6:30 am
Originally posted by chris mood
. . . but a lot of players use it as a crutch.


Yeah, I knew a guy that would always retune his guitar to be able to finger the chords he wanted. If he couldn't play a certain chord (and I'm talking simple chords here, aka 5ths, add2s) he would just retune. He had this idea that all chords should be played with just one finger.


Drop-D is fun, btw.


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# 6
pstring
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pstring
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02/19/2002 7:11 am
Jazz players are just mean, hateful people, Rockers are Lazy? yeah right!... Excuse me , could someone please hand me the TV remote control, it's slightly out of my reach down there by my foot, thanks
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# 7
skee1
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02/19/2002 4:35 pm
(Affects&Pedals-Boards-Wammy bars ect!

Mabee its the obove if you take the (Rock guitar players)
toys away from them they would not sound as good,
plus you would really hear what they sound like!
I hate to crush your idiols but if Jimmy Hendrix had never,
used affect pedals he would have never made it in the music scene plus countless others.

Mark



yours truly Mark Toman
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# 8
lalimacefolle
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lalimacefolle
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02/19/2002 4:44 pm
Not lazy in that way, but I understand Chris' view.

Lots of young guitarist think some rockers are the greatest, while lots of Jazz or classical cats just blow them away.

I can understand that Jazz guys get pissed of because someone that writes a 4 chords songs is called a "great songwriter, with awesome harmonies", while some Jazz tunes have 20 chords in them, and nobody gives a ****...
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# 9
friskynibbles
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friskynibbles
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02/19/2002 7:31 pm
It's kinda silly to hate any musician.
If you don't like it, don't listen.
I don't like country music, but I must admit that there are some damn good guitarists in there and some really great melodies. Hate = jealousy.
-Daniel
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# 10
skee1
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skee1
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02/20/2002 2:48 pm
Originally posted by chris mood
I was what you would call a jazz snob during my college yrs., and the main complaint I hear from jazz players about rock musicians is that their "lazy". Most never explore the possibilities of the instrument. An whats w/that Drop D thing and power chords? It's cool if you can actually play and your looking for that effect, but a lot of players use it as a crutch. You can't get away with that in jazz, classical, or blues.


Hey Chris
Clapton got away with it in (White-Room)<-Blues
(He used some Power chords ha ha

Mark
P:SI swear Chris that i read years ago that alot of,
Jazz players used the droped D tuning in (GP Mag)

[Edited by skee1 on 02-20-2002 at 08:54 AM]
yours truly Mark Toman
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# 11
chris mood
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chris mood
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02/20/2002 5:31 pm
Skee....
I think drop D and power chords can have a cool effect, my problem is with people who only play them because thats all they can play because they won't take the time and energy to learn anything more.
Even Kurt Cobain played bar chords (I Have it on video to prove it) but a lot of young rockers won't use them when playing Nirvana songs. I don't get it?
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# 12
skee1
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02/20/2002 6:40 pm
Your right Chris
Its an effect, which i only use in songs that were
recorded useing it.(cover songs)or 1 or 2 of my
licks in the key of D.
I do the same with the droped G .
It would be very boring plus lazy if somebody used,
these affects in every song or lick.
I guess they could use these tunings for,
flash show off stuff on stage.
I guess its easyer for them to play power chords,
while thier jumping around on stage or thier just(Lazy)

Mark

[Edited by skee1 on 02-20-2002 at 12:45 PM]
yours truly Mark Toman
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# 13
Zeppelin
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Zeppelin
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02/21/2002 8:02 pm
Originally posted by skee1
(Affects&Pedals-Boards-Wammy bars ect!

Mabee its the obove if you take the (Rock guitar players)
toys away from them they would not sound as good,
plus you would really hear what they sound like!
I hate to crush your idiols but if Jimmy Hendrix had never,
used affect pedals he would have never made it in the music scene plus countless others.

Mark




i cant agree with you.
look at ritchie blackmor or santana or page
altough they did use some overdrive they were playing with almost clean sound, not like modern metal heads.
i think the problem with jazz players is that they cant accept simple songs. if its not the most complicated harmony in the world than it wont do.
but then again many jazz players playing songs by the beatles so maybe im wrong

"They think im crazy..
but i know better.
It is not I who am crazy.
It is I who am mad.."

ren hoek
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# 14
lalimacefolle
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lalimacefolle
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02/21/2002 8:58 pm
Originally posted by Zeppelin
but then again many jazz players playing songs by the beatles so maybe im wrong


I think that what's important in Jazz is an awesome melody, and ALSO a vamp that's going to be fun to play over...

There's enough wonderful melodies in the Beatles, and their chord progressions are far from simplistic, so I guess that's why Jazz cats enjoy playing their tunes...
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# 15
skee1
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02/21/2002 9:07 pm
Sorry about the way i put that Zepp
i should have said the real heavy effect users,
Santana he has a clean sound and i like his,
clean sound even alittle distortion don't hurt.
I would never put Santana in the heavy effects class,
I lean more toward the blue's and so i would rather,
hear a few affects then 10 affect pedals!

Mark
Just my 2 cents
yours truly Mark Toman
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# 16
skee1
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02/21/2002 9:30 pm
Yesterday by the beatles and countless other tunes,
they did were great for jazz and blues guitarists.
I did play a jazz version of yesterday years ago plus
a blues version of something.(Great tunes for blues,
and jazz...(Great chord progressions)

Mark


yours truly Mark Toman
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# 17
lalimacefolle
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lalimacefolle
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02/21/2002 9:38 pm
Anyone who has heard the version ALLAN HOLDSWORTH did of "michelle" has to admit they were great songwriters.
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# 18
chris mood
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chris mood
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02/22/2002 5:47 pm
Michelle is a great example of the harmonic possibilities within a minor key, I use that one all the time in my teaching.
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# 19
Incidents Happen
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Incidents Happen
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02/25/2002 4:16 am
i think jazz musicians dont like rockers because a rocker can sit there and make millions but he sucks, while this jazz guy is great, but he makes 10 bucks a night
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# 20

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